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 Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode

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arcturusk1
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PostSubject: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:20 pm

V-mode question first. It is policy that 35 day old accounts get deleted, right? Well, I read that in the .org servers of Ogame (our servers), mods are far more lenient and won't delete old inactives that rapidly or even at all. Is there any truth to this?

As for ACS Probe Delaying, you'll have to forgive me. I have probably read how to do this 3 or 4 times and still I do not get it. I'm dumb. Something about it just simply doesn't click. Can someone explain how this works in a step-by-step layout manner, explaining all steps as if you were instructing a 1st grader? My understanding goes as follows:

  1. Esp probe a planet
  2. Send out a fleet with an esp probe
  3. ACS send another esp probe to join with that fleet?
  4. Somehow the ACS-joined probe slowed down the fleet?
  5. Fleet is magically delayed by 10 seconds?
  6. Probe again or something? Catch ninja, win the game, 200 free deathstars.
  7. Isn't there some 1.5 minute probe rule in there before fleets hit a planet?
  8. I'm slamming my head off a wall confused confused scratch scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Thu Feb 11, 2010 3:23 am

Deletion is automatic, mods have no leniancy over it.

However, you DON'T get deleted for being in vacation mode for 35 days. You get deleted for being INACTIVE (IE. Not logging on) for 35 days.

As for ACS probe delaying, it works like this:

ACS attacking is like regular attacking, but people can join the ACS attack at any time. However, they can only attack if the fleet will be slowed down by no more than 30%

Thus, you send a regular attack, it doesn't need to have any probes. But it needs to be an ACS attack!! (But you can launch it with only one fleet in the attack, you don't need to attach anything yet)

Now, a probe can reach the planet in, say, 130 seconds (if you slow it down a little). Thus, if you attach the probe to the ACS attack when the attack has 100 seconds left in the mission, you can attach it, and the ACS fleet will slow down to wait for the espionage probe. Timing is EVERYTHING!

Ideally, you want to slow your fleet by around 30 seconds. If you want to slow it down by only 10 seconds, or however many seconds, try and make the probes speed as close to 100 + <Extra time you want> seconds to go. Or, for an easier option, launch the probes when your fleet has 130 - <Extra time you want> seconds to go (for 10 seconds, launch when the main fleet has 120 seconds to go). Slowing it by only 10 seconds is useful for a fleetcrash phalanx attack, which you are afraid that you yourself will get ninjaed. Somehow. Probably involving a rather unique and judicious application of recalled deployments...

So the order is
1. Attack a planet
2. Try and organise a probe to take around 130 seconds to reach the target
3. Launch a probe as fast as you can to the planet so that it arrives around 5 seconds AFTER your fleet will attack the planet on an ESPIONAGE mission
3. With 100 seconds to go (or a little more, launch the probe on an ACS Attack mission, attached to the attacking fleet (I don't know how to do this, but it is just as if you wanted to attach an additional cruiser to the attacking fleet to make it stronger ... typical ACS attack rules apply)
4. The attacking fleet will now take 130 seconds to reach the target!! Congradulations, the fleet is slowed by half a minute.
5. Look at the probe report, when there is 25 seconds left on your extended deployment (5 seconds after the defender expected the attack, and thus 5 seconds after any defending ninja ships appeared on the colony. Congradulations, you can check if you have been ninjaed!! If you see additional ships, chances are that the defender has simmed them, so you *probably* want to recall immediatly. Like... now. Go ahead, recall.

Does that help??

Edit, and the probe rule is within the last *5 seconds* of the attack. This is because of some sort of lag exploit thingy. If you delay it by only 10 seconds, you want to probe AT THE SAME TIME THE ATTACK WAS PLANNED, because if you probe 5 seconds before the attack, you could be accused of bug-using. But probing 10 seconds before the attack is A'OK Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:33 am

digitCruncher wrote:
Deletion is automatic, mods have no leniancy over it.

However, you DON'T get deleted for being in vacation mode for 35 days. You get deleted for being INACTIVE (IE. Not logging on) for 35 days.
Whoops, meant to say Inactive instead of V-mode. Thanks for the clarification. I do swear that I read that mods on .org servers will delay inactive deletion to allow for more farms, but since I cannot produce said evidence, I stand corrected that the system does it automatically.

For the following quote, I've put my comments in pink.
digitCruncher wrote:
As for ACS probe delaying, it works like this:

ACS attacking is like regular attacking, but people can join the ACS attack at any time. However, they can only attack if the fleet will be slowed down by no more than 30%.
So it's 30% of the time it took to fly there? If it takes 60 minutes to fly there, then 30% of that would be 18 minutes. So, if at any point in the flight you attach a ship, let's say a slow one like a recycler, and that ship adds 18 minutes to the flight time, it won't work?

Thus, you send a regular attack, it doesn't need to have any probes. But it needs to be an ACS attack!! (But you can launch it with only one fleet in the attack, you don't need to attach anything yet)
I understand this part. You launch an attack and then click on the little box with the five tiny arrowy-shipy icons in the fleet movement screen next to the attack, then you can invite people, including yourself, and give the ACS attack a name.

Now, a probe can reach the planet in, say, 130 seconds (if you slow it down a little). Thus, if you attach the probe to the ACS attack when the attack has 100 seconds left in the mission, you can attach it, and the ACS fleet will slow down to wait for the espionage probe. Timing is EVERYTHING!
It is my understanding that probes don't really go that slow, and after having played with the percentages for stuff nearby me, the slowest I could go is 2 or 3 minutes @ 10% speed. It's quite the jump from 20% to 10%. So anyway, the goal is to get X / Y > .7, where X is the attack's remaining time that you are solving for and Y is the probe's time to reach the planet at a slow speed. The .7 is there to ensure that you have not broken the 30% rule. So, in your example, the equation would be 100/130 =.769 which is >.7 and thus launching at 100 seconds left is ok. Now, if we had chosen to launch when the attack has 70 seconds left, 70/130=.538 and that is not >.7 so you cannot launch then.

Ideally, you want to slow your fleet by around 30 seconds. If you want to slow it down by only 10 seconds, or however many seconds, try and make the probes speed as close to 100 + <Extra time you want> seconds to go. This I don't get. You want to make their speed 100+extra time? I thought their based speed was fixed at like 160million? Or do you mean you want to make their travel time as close to 100+extra time? Or, for an easier option, launch the probes when your fleet has 130 - <Extra time you want> seconds to go (for 10 seconds, launch when the main fleet has 120 seconds to go). For the easier option, when launching at 130-extra time, is that at the probe's full speed or is it still slowed down? Slowing it by only 10 seconds is useful for a fleetcrash phalanx attack, which you are afraid that you yourself will get ninjaed. Somehow. Probably involving a rather unique and judicious application of recalled deployments...

So the order is
1. Attack a planet
Send a normal attack, hit the box with the five tiny icons, give the attack a name
2. Try and organise a probe to take around 130 seconds to reach the target
Understandable, do the best you can to get it close to 130, but do not launch this probe! Just figure out the speed that gets the job done! Am I right?
3. Launch a probe as fast as you can to the planet so that it arrives around 5 seconds AFTER your fleet will attack the planet on an ESPIONAGE mission.
When do I launch this? Immediately after steps 1 and 2? What speed does this probe run at? Is it a slow probe? Even if you slow a probe down to 10%, it's still only about 2 or 3 minutes of travel time, so you're doing this very close to when the attack completes and this must then immediately segue into the next step...
3. With 100 seconds to go (or a little more, launch the probe on an ACS Attack mission, attached to the attacking fleet (I don't know how to do this, but it is just as if you wanted to attach an additional cruiser to the attacking fleet to make it stronger ... typical ACS attack rules apply)
So launch the step 2 probe at the slowed speed that you calculated in step 2 on an ACS mission.
4. The attacking fleet will now take 130 seconds to reach the target!! Congradulations, the fleet is slowed by half a minute.
Ok, so two probes are now running: The step 2 probe that just slowed down the attacking fleet and the step 3 probe that WAS 5 seconds after the attack but is NOW something like 25 or 30 seconds BEFORE the attack.
5. Look at the probe report, when there is 25 seconds left on your extended deployment (5 seconds after the defender expected the attack, and thus 5 seconds after any defending ninja ships appeared on the colony. Congradulations, you can check if you have been ninjaed!! If you see additional ships, chances are that the defender has simmed them, so you *probably* want to recall immediatly. Like... now. Go ahead, recall.
Ok, I got this part.

Does that help??
Yes, it does help. With the way you have laid it out I think I got it. My remaining confusion stems from steps 2 and 3 and I already asked questions about that following the respective steps.

Edit, and the probe rule is within the last *5 seconds* of the attack. This is because of some sort of lag exploit thingy. If you delay it by only 10 seconds, you want to probe AT THE SAME TIME THE ATTACK WAS PLANNED, because if you probe 5 seconds before the attack, you could be accused of bug-using. But probing 10 seconds before the attack is A'OK Very Happy
Ok, thanks for the clarification on this.
Thanks a bunch for having the patience to explain this to me. I'd like to understand it fully and with your help am almost completely there.
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:48 am

Most of your comments can be clarified thus (I think I made it MUCH more complicated than it needed to be):

You want to launch your probes attack mission at such a time that:

The probes attack time arrives at the planet AFTER your main attack arrives (thus, the main attack is slowed down to match it's speed)
The difference in times (the time between the probes attack time, and the old attack time) is less than 30% of the *remaining time* left on the mission.

Thus, if you *really* wanted to, you could (somehow) launch the probe at EXACTLY the same time as the regular fleet, and slow it down... but that wouldn't achieve much. You want to launch the probe attack mission as EARLY as possible, while still NOT allowing time for someone to ninja you (and quite frankly, if you are attacking with a probe, even at 10%, it would be difficult!!)

That description is probably easier to read.

Steps are:

1. Attack a planet
2. Try and organise a probe to take a large amount of time (ideally around 3 minutes or so, the longer, the more flexability you have)
3. Launch the probe attack mission at such a time that the time the probe will arrive is AFTER the main fleet. The time extension is limited by the remaining time of the mission. Thus, if you have 300 seconds left on the mission, you can only extend it another 90 seconds (30% rule). CONGRADULATIONS! The mission has been slowed down.
4. Espionage the planet so that the probe arrives at the planet at the same time as the OLD mission arrived at the colony
5. Look at the probe report, when there is 25 seconds left on your extended deployment (5 seconds after the defender expected the attack, and thus 5 seconds after any defending ninja ships appeared on the colony. Congradulations, you can check if you have been ninjaed!! If you see additional ships, chances are that the defender has simmed them, so you *probably* want to recall immediatly. Like... now. Go ahead, recall.

That should help much more. Less numbers means less room for error.

Step 3 and 4 can be swapped around a little, but unless you are attacking a G5 planet from a G1 planet, it is almost always better to do it that way.
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Thu Feb 11, 2010 5:56 pm

Great, thanks digitCrucher! I was able to process your revised steps more easily. I appreciate the time you took to lay this out for me.
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:10 pm

I was going to write how to do this but it appears digit cruncher has beat me to it!

If you need another explanation or clarification feel free to ask. I'm happy to help with everything and anything.
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:18 pm

i have a quick question regarding the slowing down thing,

when im attacking someone, say to crash his fleet,
woulds i be better to acs attack him with the possibility of being able to attempt
to slow down the attack in case of ninja move?

hope this makes sense Surprised
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:31 pm

Wherever possible, yes. But remember ACS attacks take up *2* fleetslots, not just one. So keep that in mind.
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:33 pm

thanks, didnt know that, so if i add 3 fleets it will take up 3 slots, and so on,
is that right?
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PostSubject: Re: Two questions: ACS Probe Delaying and V-mode   Fri Feb 19, 2010 7:58 pm

It will take 4 slots. 3 for each ACS addition, and one for the original attacking fleet.
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